Issue 623 – December 11, 2019

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Hi Andy,

The “position of responsibility” requirement for Star rank states: “While a First Class Scout, serve actively in your troop for four months in one or more of the following positions of responsibility…”

One of our Scouts was Assistant Senior Patrol Leader (“ASPL”) at summer camp for a week this past July. Then, on September 19th, he was appointed ASPL by our Senior Patrol Leader, right after our troop elections. Does his time in-between his ASPL responsibilities for that week at summer camp and the September 19th appointment by our SPL count toward the four-month responsible position and the “serve actively in your troop for four months” requirements if there no troop or patrol activities going on between summer camp and September 19th?

I’m thinking that the “down time” between the end of the summer camp week and September 19th doesn’t count, but I want to make sure I’m not missing something. (Joe Sefcik, SM, Connecticut Rivers Council)

Your concern is a good one, because situations like this can sometimes go sideways. Here’s a “for instance”… Let’s say a Scout is elected Senior Patrol Leader on September 1st and continues in that position until the next election, on March 1st of the next year. That’s six months, right? Yes, it should be, and this is what the BSA intends to happen. But there have been some Scoutmasters (and a few others) who have said that this Scout has to continue to serve for another two weeks, because the troop was inactive over the winter holidays and this “dark” period has to be made up! The answer to that is simple: It’s absolute baloney! Another argument is that that particular time period is less than 180 days (February is the typical “culprit”), so some days have to be added to meet the “180 days=6 months” standard. The answer to this one is the same: Baloney! And that’s because the BSA didn’t stipulate “days”—the BSA stipulated months.

Your own Scout is in a slightly different situation: He actually served as ASPL on two separate and distinct occasions. The first was for specifically one week while the troop was at summer camp, and his brief tenure ended on the last day of camp. The second was when he was appointed on September 19th for a “full term” so to speak.

It’s perfectly okay to add up time-in-position. This means that that Scout—who began his 4-month tenure for Star rank on September 19th—has a week’s “credit” for having served in a position of responsibility at summer camp. So this means that he will have served for four months on January 12th (instead of the 19th)! (Yes, they don’t need to be consecutive, and they don’t even need to be the same position!)

Let’s take this one more step, for your Scout… Since most troops typically hold elections and the SPL appoints the other positions every six months, make sure this Scout going four Star rank has his Star board of review as close to the four-month date of his term as possible. This way, the remaining two months of his current term can be applied to the corresponding requirement for Life rank!
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Dear Andy,

My 17 year-old grandson is scheduled to have his Eagle rank board of review sometime in the next two weeks (of December 2019). His troop is sponsored by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (“LDS” for short) and on January 1, 2020 this troop will close its doors in concert with every other LDS-sponsored troop in the Boy Scouts of America, and it is highly unlikely that any of the Scouts in this troop—with only one exception—and none of the adult volunteers will transfer to a neighboring troop.

My grandson is not the one Scout who will continue with another troop. He’s presently a high school senior and has an after-school job, so the remaining four months till his 18th birthday just aren’t in the picture for him. But he does wish to have a court of honor, and this is my question. When it comes to his court of honor, and he’s no longer a member of any troop, who would conduct it? Who would preside? Would it be appropriate for him and his friends from his troop to wear their Scout uniforms (even though they’re no longer Scouts)? Thanks for your help. (Scout Grandfather, Great Rivers Council, MO)

Is there some reason why your grandson’s board of review can’t be held sooner than “sometime in the next two weeks”? My first suggestion would be to simply move up the review date. It could probably be held just two nights from now! After all, it only takes three adults, one of whom represents the council’s or district’s advancement committee, to hold a board of review for Eagle rank. If that review is held sooner, as I’ve suggested, then his court of honor can be scheduled before the end of this calendar year. This way, there are no worries about who presides, or uniforms, or anything else. But this is just a suggestion; it’s not a recommendation. My recommendation is that all Scouts in that LDS-sponsored troop transfer into another troop in the neighborhood right away…like, right now, while there are still adult volunteers around who can manage the paperwork.

Here’s the thing—although this troop, like all other LDS-sponsored BSA units, is closing its doors on January 1st, the LDS Church is in no way prohibiting any member of this church from becoming—or remaining—Scouts or Scouting volunteers. The only thing that’s changing, as far as Scouting is concerned, is that it’s no longer compulsory for LDS ward members!

I don’t know the size of your grandson’s current troop, but I absolutely know that its youth members are benefiting from their involvement in the Scouting program. When these boys and young men walk away from Scouting of their own volition, they’re walking away from a century-old heritage that’s specially designed to help them weather the throes of life itself and ultimately offers an honor that’s known around the world: Eagle Scout.

To walk away from the opportunity to become an Eagle Scout is tantamount to a Dean’s List student quitting college in the spring of his senior year. There’s simply no need to do something that’s, in a word, senseless. It’s like an MVP quarterback walking off the field just before a national bowl championship.

So, to repeat: My recommendation is that every Scout in your grandson’s troop—including your grandson!—immediately transfer into a neighboring troop.

Yes, I get it that your grandson is a high school senior and has an after-school job. Big deal! I don’t buy into the “Eagle-and-out” mantra because I earned my Eagle at age 15 and stayed with my troop till my 18th birthday so that I could give to the Scouts “behind” me what I’d been given by the Scouts who came before me—all the while holding down an after-school and all-day Saturdays job plus double-lettering in sports. And I’ve known literally hundreds of Scouts who were seniors, had jobs, were on Varsity teams or in the school orchestra or the theater program, or tended an elderly family member after school, and the list goes on, and they didn’t quit, either.

Thanks, Andy, for your insights into our dilemma. The reason the board of review can’t be held sooner is that we only have preliminary approval from the council, because they won’t give official approval for a board of review until they’ve received the reference letters. They meet again today, so we’re hopeful that all will be well. I should mention that our district advancement committee doesn’t like to meet outside of their schedule, which is notify by the second Tuesday of the month for boards of review on the on the third Tuesday, which is now the week before Christmas Eve. They are aware of our time concerns, but we’re not optimistic that they’ll change their usual schedule for just one Scout.

As a former long-time Scouting volunteer (Silver Beaver recipient and all three of my sons are Eagle Scouts), I appreciate fully the value of Scouting. I would love to see the Scouts of this troop continue past this troop’s closing, but their Scouting program has been very weak and their Scoutmaster has given them no motivation to continue. Because I’m not a BSA member any longer, I don’t have any “official” capacity to interfere with this troop’s lack of inertia. So I guess we’ll wait and see what transpires and figure out how to hold some sort of court of honor next year, which the family will conduct “outside the box.” (SG)

Thanks for a bit of your background and hats off to your valuable service to our youth! Three Eagle sons is really cool! (Maybe one of them—or all three—can convince your grandson that earning Eagle doesn’t mean “quitting time.”)

I’m sorry your district folks are so regimented in their thinking (and schedule) that they seem to have forgotten that they’re supposed to be there for the Scouts they serve and not the other way around.

As for the current Scoutmaster of your grandson’s LDS-sponsored troop: I get it! The fundamental problem here is that, in LDS units, male youth membership is compulsory and Scouts’ parents are told by their bishops that they’ve been “called” to be the unit’s Scoutmaster, Cubmaster, Committee Chair, etc., and this is compulsory as well. Is it any wonder that many church members—youth and adults alike—who have been “volun-told” in this way enter Scouting with less than optimal enthusiasm. This Scoutmaster’s inability (or refusal) to inspire the youth he’s supposed to be serving and to provide a quality experience for them is a true pity.

However, I’ll bet these Scouts (and their parents) have never seen “Scouting in action” the way it’s supposed to be! So, maybe your grandson’s parents—and their Scout-parent friends—would be willing to organize a group visit to a neighboring troop, so they can see what a *real* troop looks like and what a *real* Scouting program looks like, too!

You’re a former Scouter. How about making this happen? You don’t have to be a BSA member; as a Silver Beaver, the value of Scouting is already in your heart! Yes, the Silver Beaver represents what you’ve done for youth…but it’s also a symbol of what you’re capable of! How about giving this one more shot… For your grandson and for his friends, too!

Happy Scouting!

Andy

Have a question? Facing a dilemma? Wondering where to find a BSA policy or guideline? Write to askandybsa@yahoo.com. Please include your name and council. (If you’d prefer to be anonymous, if published, let me know and that’s what we’ll do.)

Although these columns are copyrighted, any reader has my permission to quote or reproduce any columns or column parts so long as you attribute authorship: “Ask Andy” by Andy McCommish.

[No. 623 – 12/11/2019 – Copyright © Andy McCommish 2019]